Cultivating Professionalism

Jim Cathcart 00:05 Welcome to the Wisdom Parlor, a thoughtful discussion of important ideas among people who are committed to succeeding in life. This is a gathering of leaders from a variety of industries, and our role here is to help you reach the top 1% of your field of choice. I'm Jim Cathcart. So come with me and let's discover how much more successful you could be. Speaker B 00:38 Well, good afternoon, everybody. Welcome again back to the Wisdom Council in the parlor. If you don't know Jim Cathcart, you probably do. Jim, world renowned speaker, author of many, many books, former president of the national hall of Fame Speakers Association. Again, this parlor designed out of his mind and out of his heart that we can come together, share ideas, have a frank and open discussion, maybe solve a problem or two. But definitely we all go away better from having a good conversation today. And I have no idea what Jim's got on store because he didn't tell me in advance today. So take it away. Jim, what's our, what's our hot topic today? Jim Cathcart 01:15 Thank you. Well, our hot topic today. Hey, Julie. Hey. Speaker C 01:18 Hi, Jim. Jim Cathcart 01:20 Hi, everybody. It's nice to see so many friendly faces and names in the lineup. Oh, Pamela Sambaugh. Speaker B 01:27 That's right. Turn on your cameras if you can join us. Be actively about. Jim Cathcart 01:31 Yeah, and you don't have to, but it. But it's better when you do. Today's topic is professionalism. What is it? Can you measure it? Can you learn it? Is it teachable? If someone doesn't have it, can they get it? And what can you do with it? Okay, I want to show you something. I've been working on a number of things here and I want to show you this one. This is a concept paper that I put together for thinking about what I do with the Experts Academy. And what, what the Experts Academy's purpose is, is to certify people as a professional expert. To not only teach how to develop expertise and professionalism, but also how to achieve it. So this is about the certification of professionalism. And I've got this. This is. There's not such a box in physical form. This is just a mock up that was created for me. So here's the idea, the basic idea is that I, I have found and I believe that professionalism is learnable, measurable and teachable. And so what I want to do with the Wisdom Council and with my Experts Academy, which is the prop for profit side of it, is to grow this forum as a foundation for teaching professional expertise. Now you say, wait a minute, how do you teach people to be an expert when you don't know their category. Like, Dennis Madden is an expert in automatic transmission rebuilding. I mean, literally an expert. He not only is certified as such, he certified others through the Automatic Transmission Rebuilders association, of which he was executive director and chief of it for many, many years. And we worked together for 10 years, with me consulting with them. Well, I don't know anything about transmissions yet. They retained me for 10 years. Why? Because what I did know transcended the application in transmissions or healthcare or technology or whatever field a person might specialize in. What I've specialized in is professional skills, professional growth from the start. As a matter of fact, my first ever audio album back in 1976 was called Start Success Through Applied Regulated Thinking. And it was just a recording of a seminar I did at a church for a bunch of local people who paid me 30 bucks to attend. But my second audio product was this. Now this was 1979. Okay. How to think like a professional. It's a cassette pack. It looks like a leather bound book, but it's two audio cassettes. And the subject was how to think like a professional. I gotta throw in a little extra piece here. That's me. That's Me in 1979. Mustache and Rosy cheeks and helmet hair. The whole thing, man. But the point of bringing this up is to show that ever since I first started my business, I've been talking about professionalism. And my first training sales training course was called Professionalism in Selling. It later became relationship selling, but the idea of it was to behave as a professional, not just to be a persuader or, you know, a person that could manipulate others into buying. And when I look at the things I'm doing currently and I look reflect back over 45 years of all this, professionalism has been the key to it. Now let's stop for a second. What is profession or professional? When you look it up, and I did, I looked up profession, professional professionalism, I looked up expertise, I looked up mentor, I looked up professional development, you know, and all the related things, and drilled down to the nth degree. Professional or profession comes from the word to profess, to vow, meaning that you will vow to do what you have agreed to do, that you're committed, that you can be trusted, right? So when a person chooses a profession, they choose a field or a niche in which they're going to commit. And that's what makes them approach it in a professional way. When I've designed the eight Competencies Professional Competencies model for the National Speakers association, the reason I did it was we, we had all these different things we were doing as an association. We had three or four thousand members. And this was back in the 1980s. And I organized our, the presentations at all our meetings. We had recordings of every one of them. The articles in our magazine, the presentations done at our local chapters, the general programs, the panel discussions, the newsletters, everything we had. And I categorized them according to subject area, and I found that there were eight of those subject areas. And each of those subject areas involved a set of skills that maybe overlapped but was still different from the other areas. And so I called those skill sets a competency. So when you were competent at the skills for say, delivering a speech, that's the speech competency because it's a set of little sub skills that make up a good speech. And when you're proficient at sales and marketing of speaker services, that was a competency and so forth. So I did that for eight categories and that's in this document which I will share with all of you. Profession. If a person is committed to a profession and they behave professionally, then they're willing to be held accountable for whether they did or did not do what they agreed to do. And so I think the world needs a lot more than that and more of that. I think virtually every profession, every industry, every trade would benefit greatly by increasing the percentage of their people and the percentage of time each person is behaving professionally. And so I decided to design a curriculum around that and to teach the professional skills that transcend the individual categories. Here's the category. JCS Junior Chamber of Commerce Civic Club. I joined the JCS in 1972 as a rosy cheeked kid with no experience and of any kind in leadership. None. And when I joined the jcs, the reason I joined, as opposed to joining Kiwanis or Lions or something like that, was the JCS was for young people, by young people for the purpose of leadership training. Now, I joined as one of 20 people, actually one of half dozen people in Pulaski Heights neighborhood of Little rock, Arkansas in 1972 to form a brand new chapter. Three months later I was district director in charge of five chapters. That meant that I was the liaison between the state headquarters and the individual chapters in that little district. And I would go around and tell them the news and find out what their questions were and help them solve problems. And so I read all the leadership manuals and I chaired all the committees and you know, led discussions and things like that. Well, I moved up to position after position and within three years I had left Little Rock, Arkansas, moved to Tulsa, Oklahoma, and was hired as the, what they call me, national program director in charge of leadership training for all 356,000 USJC members in the nation at the time. So I went from a kid that knew nothing to a kid that was overcompensating by reading all the manuals three, four, and five times. And I went to 400 JCS meetings in two years after work for no pay. 400 in two years. Naturally, I would progress. But to progress to the national headquarters and be the guy in charge of leadership training for the entire nation, that was more than was expected, right? So I rose to the top 1% of my chosen field through fierce dedication, voracious learning, willingness to listen to anybody and try anything at least once, and to pay my dues and do all the sweat equity that was required to get there. Okay, fast forward 1976. I was at the JC's national headquarters and I discovered that there was a new group called the National Speakers Association. And I joined, and they had a couple hundred members and they were mostly a referral network, just a tip club. But I joined and I left my job at the jcs and I went to work doing sales consulting and coaching for a insurance agency, MassMutual, in Tulsa. And I started building my career as a speaker. And so I anything that j. The National Speakers association produced, I would devour it and study it two or three or four times more than I needed to. So I did all that, and in a short period of time, I went from being a brand new member of a small little club to being on the national board of directors as it grew to close to a thousand members. And then I became the national president when we had around 3,000, 3, 500 members, I think it was. And then chairman of the board. And then, you know, I received the Cabot Award, which is their lifetime award, named after the founder of the association, that statue over there. And then I was inducted in the speaker hall of Fame. And that's what this ring is. And I got my Certified Speaking professional designation. And I designed the training program behind the speaker designation. Hey, Mark. The training program was the eight competencies. And that's what you follow to earn your Certified Speaking professional designation. So what I'm saying is in two instances, I went from brand new beginning street level, no experience, nobody, to top 1% at the national leadership level the hard way. Okay, so when I talk about how do you reach the top 1% of any field you choose, I actually literally have done it twice and could do it again. And I can certainly show you how to do it. No matter what that field is. Is that an acceptable description? I mean, am I puffing myself up too much or am I calling it straight? Speaker B 13:48 No, actually it makes a lot of sense. Jim Cathcart 13:50 But. Speaker B 13:50 But I've got a thought and maybe as we open it up for everyone else in just a moment here during Pandemic, ask yourself, did you stay professional or did you go down a notch or two? Jim Cathcart 14:04 Yeah. Speaker B 14:04 How are you coming back with your professionalism? Because I've talked to a lot of people about this and they did hoodies, snack bar right next to him, the dog climbing over them. They were not pushing and selling, communicating. They were in person and they settled for a lesser professionalism. Now, Jim, as we go back out, you and I will both be at NSA this weekend. I'm curious how professional we are going to be as those shiny experts, or have we all shrunken back and we're going to settle for a lesser version of professionalism? So part of my question is, what is that professionalism even here in these cubes? Jim Cathcart 14:41 Okay, what do we do here? I've got a. That's a great question and thank you for asking that. Professionalism has five qualifiers. A profession. If you are a professional, you are well educated for what you do. Your education is never ending. It's lifelong and never considered to be complete. And in many cases there's recertification required, like for CPAs and others, where you have to get a continuing education unit or cpe, Continuing Professional Education credits. Okay, so well educated for your field. Education's lifelong. Third, it's done for pay. Fourth, it's done as a service to other people. And fifth, and this is a real kicker, it's done according to a set of ethical standards. There are protocols and standards for a professional that don't necessarily apply to a person who's non professional in whatever they're doing. And by the way, you can be professional about anything. You know, you could say technically law and accounting and education and medicine. Those are the professions. Other things are not. Not true. A profession is one where you profess to be doing what you're doing at a high service level with a solid education in doing it. And it's done ethically and honorably. So we created that for the profession of speaking. And there are people that say about National Speakers association, well, that's a trade association. Trade association is like Dennis's Automatic Transmission Rebuilders Association. The purpose of a trade association is to advance the trade, the craft in, in the and expanding the marketplace. So they're refining the, the, the specific techniques that are practiced. And at the same time, there's a big emphasis on expanding the marketplace. And most of a trade association's members are companies. A professional association or professional society is an association whose members are mostly individuals. And their emphasis is improving the skills, knowledge and abilities of the individuals. So it's, it's advancing the practice of that profession. Whereas that's also true for trade associations. It's primary for a professional association or society. Does that make sense? Okay, so NSA is a professional society. The experts academy and what I'm doing with it is a professional society. And so what I'm going to be doing is certifying people as a professional expert. And I want to show you something here on my desktop. So that medallion is patterned almost identically after the National Speakers Association, Certified Speaking Professional Designation or medallion. It's just that I felt the format was a good format and so I copied theirs. And I don't think I have any trademark issues with that because I didn't copy content, just format this book, which Michael Butler, who's with us here on this call, is the publisher of Cathcart Press, but his company, Beyond Publishing, is the one behind the scenes. They released that book today. And this is modern edition with new refinements of my book, the Power Minute or the Self Motivation Handbook, which is now a shorter book, more focused. And the whole thing is on reaching the top 1% of your field. And it still has all those 336 one minute ideas in it. So that's pretty cool. When I say that we're going to certify, we're going to actually teach and measure and certify people as professional experts. What are your reactions and observations about that? Assume we're all the board of directors of the association that is doing this. What are your observations about that? Because I want to avoid eye rolls, you know, where people say, oh, you're a professional coach, you know, because coaching kind of took that on as a bad rap because so many people just declared they were one. Okay, Dennis, you had your hand up first. Speaker D 19:38 Pamela was before me. Jim Cathcart 19:39 Okay. Speaker E 19:41 My thought about that is if, if you are not if. So you made a good distinction between trade associations, professional associations. I had to go get ICF certified as a coach in order to do business at the government level. So ICF has it wired in like you're, you know, if you put. I was also a certified professional expert by Cathcart Institute. That will Never Trump the I.C.F. you know what I'm saying? I mean that's just, that's already wired in and National Speakers association has your distinctions. And then in the trade associations when it comes to the skill levels, I don't really know. It's probably all over the board, but. Right. You're not saying that you want to certify somebody who's great at transmissions. You're saying they're great at. I think selling would be a perfect area where you could test that out because it sort of has to have some specificity to it. And I don't know of any certification for selling. Jim Cathcart 20:41 Well, there are some and I have a sales IQ assessment that you know, could be used as a structure for that. And then the work that you and I did together and with Frank Saar years ago on relationship selling, you know, we had a structured enough course that that it could have been used as the certification. But I don't intend to go into certifying salespeople. I want to certify professionals, professional experts, a certified professional expert and make expert what speaking is for the National Speakers Association. So NSA has Certified Speaking Professional. They would have called it Certified Professional speaker. But when we were informed while making I was in on that decision. We were informed that CPS was already registered as Certified Professional Secretary. So we said oh no, no, no, no, no change. So we changed it to Certified Speaking Professional. And so if you can certify speaking professional, which a few of us here are CSPs, then surely you can certify a professional expert and then let the expert the what they're expert at is professionalism in whatever field they choose to specialize in. And then their specialty may require its own like coaching federation or transmission rebuilding or publishing community or whatever it happens to be. Comments? Speaker B 22:16 Dennis, you had your hand up a few minutes ago. You want to jump back in? Speaker D 22:19 Yeah. Actually when you asked the question Jim, I was my first thought was what is not an expert? And that might be easier to teach in the beginning than than what is. And it being in the transmission industry for so many years. Holy Toledo. I, I have met a lot of non experts in their field and when I moved to Henderson eight months ago, it's the first home my wife and I have owned that had a pool and I didn't know anything about it. And when I went to learn some or find some experts, you know, you can't tell the difference between someone that knows what they're doing and someone that doesn't by talking to them. And so there's a whole Range of things. You know, showing up on time, Jim Cathcart 23:13 having Speaker D 23:13 some standard that the customer can understand what you're doing and why you. That your job isn't a series of tasks. There's a whole thing, a whole bunch Jim Cathcart 23:25 of things having a structure to what you're doing, you know, so that it's. You can see it, to see it in a linear fashion or see a pattern to it, which gives the other person a sense of confidence in it. Speaker D 23:38 Well, and even understanding the customer's expectation. So you're getting to a level that is really cool and up there. But some may even need to get to the very base of that. You know, just show up on time. Jim Cathcart 23:55 Just show you who Dennis is. High rev for small business, as in revving an engine up. Also high revenue. Bye. Hello. Ta da. Beyond publishing. How do I get that in front of the camera? There you go. Michael, Great book. Speaker F 24:18 Great read. Jim Cathcart 24:19 There you go. Thank you very much. Yep. Well. Yes, Julie. Speaker G 24:25 Well, Jim, coming from the world of coaching, where anyone can declare themselves a coach, Laban is really into Steve Hardison right now. Steve Hardison was one of my first coaches. And Steve Chandler, I was in their inner circles. And we were like, if you say I'm a certified coach, run for the hills. And so instead of lying on that, what I learned and how my highest paying client wrote me a check for 60,000. That was after he took a box of cash and paid me 5,000 for the first three months, plus $1,000 tip in cash. So I had no certifications under my name. Because what I learned is to be fully present with people and just see if you can be of service. And it really comes down to can you actually serve them and make a difference? And can you demonstrate that? And then do you know the enrollment process to enroll them? So I think that the expert. It really would depend on the industry that you were talking about. So that's just kind of like the different form of thought. And then it got really hard to even call myself a coach because everybody could call themselves a coach. And so it kind of created a bit of a conundrum in that. So then if there really was an expert. But if you want to be a really good coach, how do you do that? You create a life that's a living hell or an solvable problem, and you solve it and you live it and you do your inner work. And then it's wash, rinse, and repeat, and you keep investing in that. And then from that place, you can actually help people versus I'm certified. So that's that's my two cents on as far as the coaching. Speaker H 26:05 You know, you know, I think this, this idea of professionalism and being an expert is by its nature nebulous and people don't really know what you mean. And I think that you have to craft something that takes no more than 15 or 20 seconds to, to say where they go, oh, I know what you mean. And, and I, I say that, you know, I, I teach a class at the University of Texas and I was telling them, I'm going to teach you leadership of self. Well, I knew what that is, but they didn't. I asked them what does that mean? Well, they didn't know what it meant. It's, they could sort of were around leadership of others. And, and you know, to what Dennis sort of said, sometimes you gotta, you gotta explain here's what it's not. And, and that's how I did it is, is it's not leadership of others. So like you and I have talked about Jim before, you can't lead me until you lead yourself. And, but, but the point that, that I'm trying to make is that all this stuff is nebulous and it's hard to, to get your head around. And I think it'd be really valuable if you could, you know, literally in no more than 15 or 20 seconds be able to describe it. So everybody goes, oh, I know what you mean. Jim Cathcart 27:37 Good, good. Thank you. I'm going to do another screen share. I want to show you a document. This is, this little form right here is something that I send out. Not, it's not a text thing like this, it's better presented but it's something I send to my clients. And it goes with, with the question that Rich ads earlier, what is professionalism? And, and what are you going to do? Are you going to still be doing that if you have to go to zoom calls instead of live appearances, Are you still setting standards? Here's what I do. I send it out in advance and it says my service commitment to you. So it says, and I got this from my clients over a 10 year or longer period. It says what they want and what they don't want. And I'm pledging to either do or not do those items in preparation. I'll be available to discuss my speech. I'll know who you are and what your company does. I'll have a specific plan to accomplish the goals of my talk. I'll coordinate with other speakers. I'll notify you of my travel on site. I'll let you know the minute I arrive, I'll tell you the truth 100% of the time. Retire early the night before my speech, not charge a bunch of booze to my room. I will stay out of the way until it's my turn to speak. I'll be dressed appropriately. I'll never insult an audience member. I'll be easy to work with. I'll be in the room and on time during my talk. You know, I will not abuse my assignment by turning my speech into a sales pitch. I'll stick to my time frame. I'll stay around after the presentation to chat with audience. I'll send the things I promised and so forth. So in short, I will be a professional in dealing with you. So that was what I was doing, was just putting in writing in a formal way my pledge to them. And I tell you, I've gotten phenomenal comments on that. People say, oh my gosh, we were thinking about those things, but we hadn't articulated them. And thank you for saying it. And it's so reassuring to know that you're going to do or not do those things. Speaker B 29:59 And you know, so Jim, I think that's a great example of the professionalism that, that I was talking about back at the beginning. There's a professional that we can exude, we can put on, we can demonstrate. That's professionalism, being a go to expert. You could be not a go to expert and do all that professionalism stuff and fake it. But I think the go to expert is a different level, a different conversation of what is that go to expert in whatever industry you're in. And it is a nebulous thing like we're saying. I think it's two different conversations. Professionalism. I think it's something that you do exude, you do put it on, you do perform it and show it. Go to Expert oozes this. How do we help them learn about being a go to expert, not just being professional and faking it? I think that's the difference. Jim Cathcart 30:48 I see the difference. And if you, when I think about it, I think of a go to expert is a person's expert on a topic, right? A professional expert is a person who is, you can rely on them being professional in every situation and acquiring or, or either acquiring personally the expertise or getting the expertise needed by the niche, by the specific topic. And, and you're right, I need a better way of articulating that differential. But I think that's the key because what I want is I want to get more people to behave more professionally. I Want them to make a commitment. If I say it, I'll do it. If I do it, I'll do it on time. I'll do it in the way that I was expected to do it and, and had pledged to do it. And I will stand behind my work and take the heat if I did it wrong or failed to show up. Right. So in other words, I'm. You can count on me. And that's, that's the kind of creature I'm trying to create in this Frankenstein lab here where we're patching things together. Right. Speaker B 32:06 Anyone else got any other questions, thoughts, comments? When I wait, I am writing, by the way. I, I am literally writing. We got the first trap back today, a book on being a go to expert. That is my first book coming out. So the very stuff you're talking about is what I've been digging into myself. It's funny that you brought that up. Jim Cathcart 32:23 The topic today, outstanding. We'll get my, my little concept paper on that and, and you know, that'll help you organize your thinking. Julie, Julie. Speaker G 32:35 So Jim, who is your audience then? Because like if you're talking about, have to have to have this conversation about what a professional is that a lot of like your clients that are in your experts academy and things are already pretty established and have got a pretty good baseline of that's what you do. So I, I was thinking of, why not write a book of what makes you not professional? Because when I was really young, I started my first business. I was 21 years old and I started a floral shop and I was doing up to the 360 just weddings a year. And my mom was the cake lady and she would do up to 1200 wedding cakes a year. And so a lot of times I would end up delivering her cakes and we had a lot of the same accounts and I was so young and immature back then that and my mom was really being a hassle. I was not happy with my mom. And so I just went off very, very unprofessionally with my friend Dorothy at the Hilton at the time. And she pulled me aside and she had the conversation to let me know that that is unprofessional. And that changed the course of my life because you know, I'm like I'm 21 and it's a mom and you're reacting and it's weddings and it's stressful and that actually just changed the whole game. So I'm almost wondering if a book of examples of what it means to be not professional because I had to learn that the hard way. Jim Cathcart 33:59 That's, that's a great lesson. There's got to be a parent somewhere. Yeah. Steps in and she was your surrogate parent, steps in and says, hey, this is not acceptable. Speaker G 34:10 Yeah. Jim Cathcart 34:11 Like when I was being coached for sales training by a man named Doug McDonald back in the 70s in Tulsa, and I was, I was going to be doing this, taking over as a sales trainer from him. And he was an older insurance agent who had been doing all the training for the agency. And so I got all the materials, I went through it and I mastered it, more or less. And Doug says, okay, let's role play a sales call. And we went through it and we got to the end and I had determined who he was, what his situation was, what he needed, prescribed it. He started giving me objections and every objection he gave me, I had an answer for because it was all in the book. You know, he'd say, well, that costs too much. Well, I understand how you feel. Others have felt the same way. However, they have found, you know, or Jim, I. I've got a brother in law in the business. Well, that's the very reason you should listen to me. Because you've been getting biased information from a limited resource. Well, Jim, not, not right now. Well, your reluctance may be the primary reason you should go ahead and act. Because up to, you know, and I had all these answers. He said, stop what? He said, you're about to make a sale. I said, duh. And he said, no. He said, jim, you're about to sell me something I don't need. He said, based on our role play and who I told you I was and what my situation was, your recommendation was too big for me and you were trying to sell it and I was trying to resist and I was giving you all these excuses and for every one of them you had your memorized answer and you just rolled it out like, you know, I was supposed to be agreeable after that. And we finally got to a point where I either had to buy or humiliate myself. And so I was going to buy, but within three days, because it's my legal right, I was also going to cancel and I was going to resent you ever after. You know, I was crushed. Well, Doug, I just said in a book, you know, and he said, jim, he said, I get that your heart was in the right place, but your head wasn't. He said, son, you gotta approach this as if you're really trying to help. I said, well, I thought I was. He said, no, you thought you were trying to get an A in selling. I said, well, yeah. And he said, wrong goal. He said, if you can't help, don't sell. Go talk to somebody else. Instead. He said the purpose of selling. He didn't say these words, but this is the way I've come to articulate it is to make someone's life better at a profit. And that was a grow up day for me, Julie. That was, that was when I had to put on my big boy pants and go out and, you know, behave like a, like an adult thereafter. And I think that that really is a vital point. You asked, who is my market? My market is the people I've been working with for the past 45 years. In other words, meeting planners, business owners, leaders, people in key positions that want their people to behave more professionally. And they already know what's unprofessional. You know, the rank and file person out in the marketplace may not realize that some things are very unprofessional. But the people that I'm seeking are the ones who would hire me to come in as an advisor or consultant, a speaker, a trainer, a person that would do an orientation. It's like Dennis and I took a board of directors and did a session for them a few hours long, just on how to be a board of directors. Because there's a whole lot of boards that don't know how to run meetings and don't know how to make decisions and don't know, you know, they don't understand anything about being effective in a group. And you hand them a copy of Robert's Rules of Order, and they try to, to do it like, I understand how you feel, you know, in other words, they're saying, okay, Rich had a motion and it needs just second. Oh, it needs a second. Who would like to second? You know, and they do the whole silly thing mechanically. It's not about that. It's about true leadership, professionalism. And so that's, that's what my intent is, to get more people, more organizations, and to embrace a revival of professionalism in the marketplace. Jody, did you have your hand up? Speaker I 39:09 I was giving your motion a second. Jim Cathcart 39:11 Oh, okay. Thank you for seconding that motion, Dennis. Speaker B 39:14 I saw your hand go up. Jim Cathcart 39:15 Yeah. Dennis. Speaker D 39:16 Well, I think Julie was first, but mine will be quick. I think Julie should write a book called Professionals Wouldn't do that from her story when she was a florist. I thought that was really good. So I like that. Jim Cathcart 39:28 I like that. Speaker G 39:29 It will be a thick book. I got a lot of stories. So Jim. Jim Cathcart 39:36 Yeah. Speaker G 39:36 Okay, so in coaching there's the like the ultimate distinction. The mother of all distinctions is the owner versus victim. Jim Cathcart 39:45 Yeah. Speaker G 39:45 And if you try to sell the owners versus victim, there's a very small percentage that want to say, well, I have to be a victim or I have to be this or. So I'm wondering what you're selling is professionalism, but I'm wondering what the real benefit is like if your program actually is to go pro and professionalism, but you would just package it in a different way like how to increase your bottom line or how to, you know, be the best. Jim Cathcart 40:11 Yeah, that's already. Speaker G 40:12 I feel like that that's, that's kind of where there may be. It might be just a twist of that because our people are people are our company sitting at meetings. Goal. I wish somebody would write a program on how to be more professional. They're probably not saying that. They're probably saying, wow, I really wish that my team would behave. Da da da da da. And then so the solution is that. But what you're selling is a different result, whatever the client is seeking. Speaker B 40:38 So I want to tack onto that because I think if you do a questionnaire, Jim, I think if you literally ask people what's a professional, what is professionalism? Say give me five traits or five whatever of professionalism and then flip it and go, what's a go to expert? Give me five examples of what makes go to expert. Jim Cathcart 40:55 Good idea. Speaker B 40:56 Do you have massive of a variant list you're going to get? Yeah, it'd be incredible now you are going to find common thread. But I think that's how much of a distance there is. But I think it'd be good research. Go back to some of your colleagues and say you define it for me. I mean, even if you came into the par earlier today and said everyone take five minutes, write something down and share them back to the group, even in this group, we would have had a diverse selection today. Jim Cathcart 41:19 That's true. Yep. Well, over the years I've been positioned as two different things. One is a motivational expert or resource for giving speeches or doing that kind of consulting and the other is as a sales expert. And I've got the credentials in both of those fields that that would go along with that. And I've, I've of course written books and, and done all kinds of publishing on both topic focuses. The thing that I've chosen to do recently. Recently was two days ago, the word professional just exploded in my consciousness as I was going through all My other material is to not focus on selling, but to sell professionalism as an enhancement of. Of the selling that's going on or the training that's being offered. Right. And not to focus on leadership, but to focus on professionalism in leadership. And so I'm still offering leadership training, I'm still offering sales training, I'm still offering motivational training and, or speaking and. Or whatever. But it's with the focus being on raising the level of professionalism in practice and that I've found so far that every time I ask a person, are your people behaving as professionally as you would like them to? The answer has been no. What would you like to see different? And they tell me basically the kind of things we've been talking about. Michael in San Antonio, or are you in Dallas today? Which one? Speaker F 43:03 I'm in San Antonio. No questions. But just really good content here today. Sorry, I had to answer a few calls, but I've been auditing and listening in to all the good feedback. Jim Cathcart 43:15 By the way, is Mentor minutes officially out today? Is it in Amazon and Barnes and Noble? I haven't found it yet. Speaker F 43:23 Yeah, I sent you a text. It's going live everywhere. Even your tracking number on your. On your books are shipping. So I will share that with you as soon as everything goes live. That way you can share links and blast it out as well. Jim Cathcart 43:35 Love it, Love it. Thank you for that. Speaker F 43:38 Kudos on that. Jim Cathcart 43:39 Yeah, thank you very much. All right, so what, taking a look at all this, let's stop thinking about Jim. What does this mean to you? Individually and or collectively? What is this, all this, the subject that we're talking about, what does it mean to you? Speaker G 44:01 Well, Jim, it's something I'm really struggling with right now to get my branding right because I really do facilitate really deep transformation through my entertainment. Right. And I just got the division of fun because really fun and play is actually a forgotten medium for real change. When people are laughing, they really change. And so I have company, culture, things. I've got my keynotes where I transform the whole audience into rock stars. And so I'm trying to find the balance between I am really a professional, but how I actually transform your. Everything is through fun and through play. And it's amazing. People walk out with different voices and it's transformtainment, sure. But how do I present myself as a professional? Because I am, you know, I've invested over a hundred thousand dollars in developing to where I am right now, but now I deliver it through fun, through play, through actually learning how to sing and all that. And so I'm really struggling to look professional enough, but yet really not, because what I deliver is fun, and it translates. Jim Cathcart 45:12 I see that as a professional specialty. I don't. I don't see anything unprofessional about play. Speaker G 45:20 Okay. Jim Cathcart 45:20 You know, professionalism's in the way you present yourself and the way you conduct Speaker G 45:24 your craft, which is everything on your list, because I learned the hard way, starting at 21. Speaker B 45:32 So, Julie, are you an expert in that playfulness and fun that you're talking about? Do you consider yourself a go to expert there? Speaker G 45:40 I am absolutely an expert, and there is nobody that does what I do. I'm very, very disruptive in the voice industry because I can instantly help people sound better and not blow their voice out. And I actually teach that in my presentations. Nobody's teaching voice that way because they've all spent thousands and thousands of dollars learning all this boring technique that nobody likes to do. Speaker B 46:02 Yeah. I would recommend again, you brand that you market the daylight, that you are the fun gal. You are the fun expert. You're the fun. You change the work environment with fun. Market the daylight out of that brand. Speaker G 46:14 Well, that's what I do is I say, hey, I cure fun deficit disorder. That's fdd. That's my thing is fdd. And I do own that. I made that up. And I own the domain fund deficit disorder. So I just. I think I just need to find the right companies that get it. Jim Cathcart 46:31 Yeah. By the way, hello to Fred Moskowitz. Fred, thanks for joining us. Thank you. Speaker J 46:38 Thank you for having me. It's great to be here. Jim Cathcart 46:41 Where are you located, Fred? Speaker J 46:43 I'm in Philadelphia. Jim Cathcart 46:44 Oh, wonderful. Yeah, wonderful. The city of brotherly love. Speaker J 46:48 Yes. Yes. Jim Cathcart 46:50 I've got a picture of me in front of the rocky statue, you know, like all the tourists do. Speaker H 46:55 Nice. Jim Cathcart 46:56 I went for. Went for a jog that day, and I. I pulled off the pose in front of Sylvester. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Speaker J 47:03 It's a nice view of the city from at the top of those steps. Jim Cathcart 47:07 Yeah, exactly. Also a great city to explore intellectually. Do you remember, some of you may remember Ralph Archbold. Ralph Archbold was the premier Ben Franklin character in Philadelphia. He as a young speaker, and I met him when he was in his probably 30s or 40s. He had enough physical similarity to Ben that he could pull off a convincing act. But he decided, and he was living somewhere in Indiana or Illinois or something, Michigan maybe. He said, I want to do Ben Franklin, but I don't want to do an act. I Want to personify Ben Franklin. I want to be Ben Franklin, you know, to enter that character and live and behave that way and take gigs doing that. Not where I would put on a performance, but where people would say, Dr. Franklin, I was wondering, and they asked me a question, and I give them a genuine answer, the way I think Ben might have done it. And so he said, but if I'm going to do this, I shouldn't live in Michigan. I should live in Philadelphia. So he moved to Philadelphia anyway. He got some craftsmen to make a original, as if in the day costume to be just like Ben Franklin's would be if he had it today. And he went around and started practicing his craft. He became the premier. There are lots of people in Philly that do that. He became the premier guy. He's the one whose picture is in the taxi cabs on the back of the seat and in Jim's Philly cheesecake up on the wall, you know, and places like that and billboards. He married a woman who was also doing a character of Dolly Madison. And so they got married at Independence hall by the mayor of Philadelphia and rode away in a carriage and went to Paris, where he was met in a similar fashion and celebrated in Paris as if it were the real Ben Franklin once again. Unbelievable. Ralph was just such a good guy and truly a professional, but a professional in a different way than the others who were simply getting paid to act like or look like Ben Franklin. And he didn't pursue an acting career going into movies. He lived it day to day in Philadelphia. And he gave my son and me a tour of Philadelphia, including going to the City Tavern and sitting at Ben's favorite table and having Ben's favorite dish and that sort of thing. And it was. I mean, man, it was a life imprint. So, you know, you can apply professionalism to virtually anything. I was telling a friend earlier today, John, you'll appreciate this. I was telling my buddy Terry Brock, who is a professional in the field of technology and the application of it to business. I was telling him about when I was a kid, I lived in Little Rock, Arkansas, and I found out that a donut shop in our neighborhood was hiring kids to sell donuts door to door. And so you could go up there on a weekend and if you went like five in the morning, they would give you a basket filled with half dozens of donuts, hot and fresh out of the vat or whatever those things are, and you go door to door and sell them throughout the neighborhood. And so a half dozen of us kids would go up there and grab our baskets full and we'd go in different directions. And then we'd come back and meet, restock, and go out for a second sweep. Well, after I'd done that for a few weeks, my dad said, come here. He said, I've got an idea for you. Instead of going up there several blocks away and working neighborhoods where you don't know a soul, why don't you go around our neighborhood not on the weekend, but on Friday? And some of these people, you can call them on the phone, but, you know, go to the neighbors and ask them if they would like hot, fresh donuts for breakfast tomorrow. And then when you go to the donut shop, you've already got all your orders. Just come home and deliver them. And they'll be delivered even more fresh and than the ones that you sell door to door, because it may take you a couple hours to get them all sold. So I did that and I set up basically a, like a paper route of people who were regular buyers of Saturday morning and Sunday morning donuts. And I had my little business going, and mom would drive me up there and pick up the goods and I'd come back and deliver them. And, you know, I had dad, who was a telephone repairman, as my. My strategic advisor. So, you know, you can be more professional in stages in virtually anything you do. And that's, that's the thing that I want to get people. I want to popularize it again because it's fallen from favor. You know, we went like, during the Jimmy Carter administration, we went from a very stuffy man in the gray flannel suit society to a much more relaxed early 60s and 70s kind of a mentality where guys are growing their hair long, you know, and. And they're wearing jeans with a tear at the knee and things like that, and tie dyed T shirts. And Jimmy Carter himself, as president of the United States, instead of always being in a suit and tie, would sit around in his Mr. Rogers outfit and talk to the nation, you know, in a cardigan sweater. Well, then Ronald Reagan came back and he sort of repopularized the formality of the pomp and circumstance around the presidency. And not that he wanted to tell everybody to do that. He was just raising the standards of operation for the office itself. And that, I think, is the thing I'm trying to do with professionalism in general is to give our society a new enthusiasm for being classy, for being appropriate, for being considerate and professional. One quick comment, and then I'll go to Yours. One of my staff came to me years ago. He had lied to me, and so I was letting him go, and I told him, you know, go in there, get your gear together. You're out of here. So he goes into his office and he closes the door and he does whatever he's doing. And he comes out with a form he wants me to sign. And he says, here, I need you to sign this. And I look at it, and it's basically a form that says for all the business he's been working on, that comes in later, I'll have to pay him a commission after he's gone. And I said, I'm not going to sign this. And he said, well, you know now. I said, what? Speaker I 54:43 What? Jim Cathcart 54:44 Your whole demeanor has changed. You're. You're behaving weirdly. What are you doing? He said, well, I'm just trying to be professional. I said, well, it's not working. And it wasn't. And so finally, you know, we parted ways and everything ended fine. But professional is not. It's all about the money. It's not stuffy. It's about professing to be the kind of person they're hoping you are. And I think that's a. A kicker. Be the kind of person your customers hope you are. Or if we could get more people to do that, everything would work, wouldn't it? Speaker B 55:28 So what is the new version of authentic professionalism? Jimmy? Like I said, during COVID many people showed up, CEOs, high level executives, in their concert T shirts. They did the Jimmy Carter thing. But now we're going back out. Even here, more people are beginning to realize you need to show up, be on time, be professional. So is there a code of conduct we're talking about? Is there an expectation we're talking about? Jim Cathcart 55:52 Yep, that's a good point. And I think, yes, there needs to be. In every industry, in every area of focus, there needs to be a code of conduct. Not a contract you have to sign necessarily. But in the National Speakers association, we realized years ago, if we're going to train people to be professional speakers, to care about their customers, to, you know, to do more than just be a showman that travels from city to city doing a performance. If we're going to be truly professional, then we're going to have to support each other. We're going to have to serve our clients better. We're going to have establish a set of standards that we expect each other to live up to. And so we came up with a code of ethics and professional standards. And that was. That's part of the sign in when you're joining the National Speakers Association. I think every organization could benefit from that. Comments? Speaker B 56:47 No, I was just going to ask everybody here in full transparency, do you show up here on Zoom business calls the same way you go out to do a in person business calls? Is there a double standard now by what we've created through virtual business? I'm just curious. Speaker I 57:06 Same exactly. I dress professional unless I'm doing something like going to a yoga class, then I wear yoga clothing, but I dress for what I'm about to do. I also have to say that I've noticed people have slacked off in their professionalism. And sometimes before I leave the house, I say to myself, zero expectation. And I'm going to be impressed today because if you expect too much, you're going to be disappointed. If you expect nothing, you're going to be just ecstatic with anything that goes well. Jim Cathcart 57:38 I think if you're the presenter, then there are different set of rules for you than if you're an attendee. If you're an attendee, as long as you're not distracting, I think however you're dressed is fine. But that's sort of the business casual approach. But business casual itself has dropped down a notch from where it was say three years ago. Business casual used to be almost for a guy, the same outfit, just take your tie off, you know, and then it went to polo shirt and, and slacks and then polo shirt and jeans and then nice T shirt and jeans and, you know, so it's business casual. Very different critter today than it was in 2019. And so when I'm doing a call like this, I mean, this, you could consider this western shirt casual or you can consider it sort of upscale. I consider it for this kind of forum, somewhat upscale, you know, as opposed to say a golf shirt. But it depends on the mix of the audience. If they say, okay, you're my keynote speaker, this is a conference, nationwide conference. Some people will be gathered in small groups, others will be at the convention facility. You're coming in remotely. I'm putting on a suit and tie because that's what's expected from the subject expert. That's the keynote speaker today. Right. If it's a board meeting, I'm putting on at least probably a sport coat, maybe open collar, because it's more dialogue than monologue. That. Would you like to see changed or done next? Either one. Changed or done next on the NEXT Speaker B 59:28 Wisdom Parlor, which would be April 5th, by the way. Mark that down. April 5th, first Wednesday, first Wednesday, Wisdom Jim Cathcart 59:36 Wednesday, always the first Wednesday. Speaker B 59:41 Is there a topic you're wrestling this? Is there something you want addressed to Jim Cathcart 59:45 be something everybody can relate to? You know, last time it was how do you find immediate revenue? And this time it's been about professionalism. Can you measure it? What is it? And you know, is it. Is it something worthy of putting our energy behind? Yes, Jodi. Speaker I 60:02 I think communication is a really important topic. I think a lot of times people use their cell phones to read their emails and they miss a lot of things in the emails because someone who's sitting at a desktop is sending a long hand, very long message. Somebody's looking at their cell phone, they're missing some of it. And so part of the professionalism, just to kind of backtrack to there is sitting at an actual desktop and making sure you're really reading the full email and responding to everything. But the next thing that I'm really getting to is people communicate too much in an email. And the way Amazon does things, it's bullet points. Three bullet points. Do not write a paragraph. Ignore if it's a paragraph. If there's three bullet points, those three things will be addressed. So you may notice in some of my messages to you, I number things because I feel that it's really important to make sure that everybody understands each of those important things. When things aren't numbered, bullet pointed out, people miss stuff. And my advice to people trying to be professional is do not answer emails from your cell phone. It's not working. Anybody that I've done that with, I fired people because I just am so frustrated that I've sent them the same question over and over, and they're reading from their cell phone and they're missing it and they're just not getting it. So you gotta definitely, you know, do the job. Jim Cathcart 61:20 Thank you, Dennis. Speaker D 61:21 I like what Jody is saying, and it reminds me of something. Everything of meaning can be put in the form of a brochure. And sometimes I'll get some information and so long and in depth that I put it down after 30 minutes. And so, yeah, you're right, Jody. On your desktop and bullet points and. And if they want more, we can pick up the phone and really have a good conversation. Jim Cathcart 61:52 Yep. Speaker H 61:53 Jody, I think what you said is. Is so right. You know, Peter Diamantes, I don't know if you guys know who Peter did. Diamantis is pretty amazing guy. Anyway, he has a rule that no email should be over five lines long right at the first. You need to ask for whatever you want. First line, you know, let's zoom next week or let's have a meeting and not make people, you know, go through the whole email to figure out what you want. And, and you know, one of the things I find is a real pet peeve is people that don't return emails or text when they know you. I get it. If, if you don't know the person in there emailing you, no obligation to acknowledge you got the email. But come on, people, you know, if you know the beat who's sending you the email, friggin let them know you got the email. Is this just me or do you Jim Cathcart 62:52 all have the same problem? That's me too. Yeah. And if you get a text or something, an email, whatever, it doesn't have to be a lengthy response. Oh, hello John. Thank you for writing today. It was really nice of you to send those ideas. I'm going to consider them and as I look through the material, I noticed that. No, just send him a thumbs up. Yeah, it got through. You know, I was talking to a guy the other day on Sunday and I said, I said, hey, I sent you a idea the other day and I said, the idea is all yours. I don't expect any ongoing ownership in it, but I thought it would be something you could use. I said, did you ever get that? He said, oh yeah, I got that. That was really good, you know, so. But I said, so just anything like that. Acknowledgment. Speaker B 63:42 So Jodi, I think it's a great topic. It's also cutting around. Cut, cut through the noise because you do want to be direct, you do want to connect. Jim, I've actually read articles where people are saying, don't do just a thumbs up. At least acknowledge them by name. Let them know you got it. Because there's so much noise. Jim Cathcart 63:59 Well, if it's your family member though, right, right to your son. Yep, the little thumbs up. Got it, dad. Thanks. Speaker B 64:06 But there's so much noise right now. How do we show that this is important? Please follow up and not do a ramble, but also not make it too tiny that it doesn't mean any value. How do we cut through the noise when we're all getting bombarded all the time? Jim Cathcart 64:21 Here's a thought. When I'm thinking about email, I think about it like the old seminars they used to do on image, professional image. The professional image is a combination of the way you're packaged, the way you carry yourself, the first things you say and how you say them, and Then your handshake and eye contact and things like that. Well, look at an email, what's the first thing they see? Who it's from? And if, if it says Jim Cathcart or jim@cathcart.com, there's very little confusion as to who that's from. If it's from infoitarmusiclive.com you have no clue who that's from. But it's something to do with the guitar. Okay, I own the domain guitar music live.com so I could send it from that. But I'm not going to do that if I'm trying to get, get it read. Right. So the way your name comes across, first thing, second thing they see is the subject line. And by the way, subject and re are the same thing. So subject means what we're going to talk about today. And regarding re colon is what we're going to talk about today. So what we're going to talk about today, what we're going to talk about today is now just put in the subject line, whatever the topic is, and get to the point, but make it succinct. So that's your appearance, you know that the combination of who it's from and, and the subject line, that's, that's the way you showed up in the room, the way you're standing, carrying yourself and packaged. First sentence, first line, first sentence. If it starts with the word I, you might want to reconsider that because instead of eye contact, you've got eye content and your eye content's already too high. Speaker I 66:16 It should also think that sometimes people need to tailor their communication to the generation. I know that there's some people, I call them, they don't answer their phones. They're only going to respond to a text. So I know when I call my sister in law who's in her 30s, I'm not going to actually call. It's going to be a text. Yeah, but when I call my mother, it's going to be a call and not a text. And she gets very upset with my sister in law because she says she doesn't take my calls. Why aren't I important? It's generational. Speaker E 66:44 It's. Speaker I 66:44 She doesn't understand that it's important to you to hear her voice. So when you're communicating with clients at different levels, like in E commerce, you got people who are 20 years old and you've got people that are, you know, 30, 40 years older than that, they communicate in different ways. Jim Cathcart 66:57 So we have to definitely do. My grandson Text only. John Mitchell Email. Because if I send him a text, it may reach him, may not. If I leave him a voicemail, I may not hear back from him that day. But if I send him an email, I'm getting through. And so everybody's got a pmoc. Pmoc. Preferred mode of communication. Preferred mode of communication. And the earlier you determine what theirs is, the more likely you are to be able to get through to them when you need to. Julie Furman. Yes. Speaker C 67:36 Yeah, I just wanted to. The whole topic today is about professionalism and sadly, one of our roles as professionals, each one of us is we have to ask each person we're working with what is their pmoc. And it's really aggravating, but we have to do it. In my world, I'm trying to make introductions happen. Maybe I want to introduce Jim to Paula, but I'm like, wait a minute, Paula doesn't get her emails. She didn't respond. Every email, every text I do, I have to go in and see are they responding to my texts, are they responding to my emails? It's unbelievable how much work it is, but it's part of what we have to do as professionals these days. We can't expect the world to adapt to what we want. We have to adapt to all of these other things. Jim Cathcart 68:23 And by the way, what Julie is doing and has been doing for a while, but has renewed her energy around this, is she's working to professionalize the, the practice of matchmaking. She's been in that, you know, relationship connections business for many, many years as a professional. But many folks in that field, just like all other fields, tend to be transactionally based. What's going to get a. What's going to get a check? Right. Will they sign the contract? Okay, over next, instead of what's the right thing to do? How can we make this work so that they consider me their friend for the rest of their dating career? Right? Speaker C 69:09 Yes. And one of the things I will tell you guys is I've known Jim Cathcart since I started my company in la and my company is service based because of Jim Cathcart's little talking in my ear on the hiking trail all these years. You just exude professionalism. So those of us who hang out with you end up raising our game. And I've been listening to you for 20 years. And so you have made an impact in my industry. So thank you for that. Jim Cathcart 69:42 I need a little voice coaching. Who's going to cry now? Thank you. That was very, very nice. I appreciate that. Very Much. By the way, Fred, we haven't heard anything from you much yet. I'd love to know what, what's your area of focus and, and so that the rest of the folks have a sense of who is. Fred. Speaker J 70:02 Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Jim. My area of focus is in the investment space. I speak a lot and teach a lot about investment strategies and educating investors and I run an investment fund. So I do what I teach and I teach about, about the strategies and so what I love is speaking about, about financial concepts and, and educating people on different, different ways to be smart about what you do with your money and, and to put it to work for you. And I, I love some of the things that, that are being discussed here. In particular about setting an example for others. Especially we're in a role that we're speaking and presenting. I always like to take the approach of be a little bit, show up a little better than most of the people in the audience. You don't want to stand out. Yeah, not to stand out and be flashy and flamboyant, but a little bit, a little bit better. Maybe enough that you get noticed is probably about right. That's, that's what I, I like and I, I really feel that it exudes a sense of professionalism. You'll get taken seriously and it starts off any interactions on a good foot. Jim Cathcart 71:44 Very good. Thank you for that. We're coming up to quitting time here. Actually. We're only committed to an hour on this, but I like to be able to go an hour and a half for anybody that wants a little extra from this or wants to contribute more to it. John Mitchell has recently changed the focus of his work to focus on teaching young adults in college. Basically what I've been identifying as professional skills, the kind of life skills and the kind of self leadership that's necessary for them to, to do well in whatever discipline they choose after they've graduated. And that's, that's, that's where I think school's been letting us down. Although John is, is not letting us down at the University of Texas, he's now taken on a new course in addition to the teaching he does there already. And John's had his own brilliant career where he grew his income by 25 times practicing the techniques that he teaches. So he's, he's well settled and doesn't have to go teach. He's teaching because he loves it and wants to. But that's the point of school, is that school ought to teach us how to be better when we're not in school. And instead, school has focused far too often on just teaching us things that will get us an A in math class or, you know, social studies or whatever else, but won't necessarily prepare us to, to build a business or be hired or anything else beyond just the technical credentials. And so that's what all of us collectively are about. And I, I'm glad I'm in it with you, all of you. Rich, you want to bring us in for a landing? Speaker B 73:37 Yeah. This has been great, everybody. Great, great conversation again. This, this whole struggle between professionalism. Go to Expert. It would be fun to hear your thoughts, think on this, write Jim back, send us a email, let us know what your thoughts are and how this shakes out in your particular area. One, one thing is we're all in different areas, but some of this does overlap and it can make a world Jim Cathcart 73:59 of difference to the people watching the recording of this. Speaker B 74:02 Yes, please, please, please don't forget, we're back again April 5th for another one of the wisdom parlors. Jim and I are both traveling. We'll be in San Antonio. So you've done a little rearranging for the Friday group, right, Jim? Jim Cathcart 74:17 Yeah, yeah. Friday group is the Experts Academy going pro. And we just moved it forward to Thursday. So the folks that are enrolled in that, you know, we'll be gathering same time of day, 2pm Central, noon on the west coast on Thursday. Speaker B 74:34 And don't forget to join the Facebook groups and join all the other part of the community aspect of this and then any final comments from anybody. Speaker J 74:42 Yeah, yeah. Rich, can you share the name of the Facebook group that you mentioned? What's the name? Jim Cathcart 74:48 Facebook group is for the people enrolled in the Experts Academy. Speaker B 74:52 Yeah. Jim Cathcart 74:53 Okay, so just go to cathcart.com goingpro or cathcart.com experts and you'll see the details on that. And if you want to enroll, then you've got all kinds of extra resources Speaker B 75:06 there, tons and tons. Jim. Jim and I were on a call the other day and he was like, oh my gosh, he's added so much. Seriously, he has front loaded this thing with the Going Pro. So please check it out yet. What was the book you were holding up, Jim? Jim Cathcart 75:21 The book was Dennis Madden's and, and my book, High Rev for Small Business. But today, Today, today, today, March 1, 2023, Mentor Minutes comes out on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Speaker B 75:40 So that's gonna be a wrap for today. Thanks everybody and come back and join us next month. Jim Cathcart 75:45 Thank you all and thanks again, Julie. Such a sweet thing. To say thank you for joining us today in the Wisdom Parlor, a thoughtful discussion of important ideas among people who are committed to succeeding in life. If you are committed to making more success happen in your own life, go right now to my website free cathcart.com and download my free ebook and then watch the video. If you decide that you'd like my assistance in helping grow your success, then come with me and let's discover how much more successful you can be.