Rich or Famous?

Speaker A 00:05 Welcome to the Wisdom Parlor, a thoughtful discussion of important ideas among people who are committed to succeeding in life. This is a gathering of leaders from a variety of industries and our role here is to help you reach the top 1% of your field of choice. Hi, I'm Jim Cathcart. So come with me and let's discover how much more successful you could be. Welcome to the Wisdom Parlor, a thoughtful discussion of important ideas among people who are committed to succeeding in life. This is a gathering of leaders from a variety of industries and our role here is to help you reach the top 1% of your field of choice. I'm Jim Cathcart. So come with me and let's discover how much more successful you could be. Speaker B 01:16 Well, welcome, welcome, welcome everybody. You come flying in beaming in from various places around the world. Welcome to the Wisdom Parlor. Today we're looking forward to a great conversation. If you don't know me, I'm Rich Bondtrager, more commonly known as the Trigger. I'm staying co hosted with Jim Cathcart and the Wisdom Parlor. Looking forward to a great conversation. And today we're going to start thinking about even now start thinking about this question, where to put the emphasis? Are you going to put it on riches or fame? That's the conversation for today that we're going to dive deeper and deeper into. And as we begin to roll into this, as you beam in today, just a reminder here that the Wisdom Parlor is here to help us all. It's a forum to discuss important ideas. And it's not a debate, it's not a political forum. It's not a religious issue forum. It's a place where we will have great idea, wisdom. Shared wisdom will emerge among people that are committed to make a world a better place. Please, no self promotion. As we go further into this today, no campaigning for any one issue or one particular company. Just have a thoughtful, insightful, fun conversation with Jim and the rest of us. By the way, if you did not know about this, this show is sponsored by the Cathcart Institute Experts Academy. It's a 12 month mentorship that results in people receiving the CPE, a certified professional Expert designation. And to book a call with Jim himself and determine if you are fit for this exclusive program, go to schedule.com cathcart we'll put that in the chat in just a few minutes as well. And if you want a free copy of a book that Jim's been putting out recently, what to do when you are a speaker. When I get a hold of that, go to free Cathcart.com he's got so many. He has so many books. Everybody, just come on. Just be real about it. But without any further ado, we are getting this great conversation. We're going to open up microphones and let the discussion begin. I want to welcome Jim Cathcart as our host. And he has authorized 25 books, delivered 3400 highly paid lectures all around the world. He has reached the top 1% of the 1% in the world of professional speaking. And Jim Cathcart is a leader, influencer, and mentor and friend. Welcome once again your host, Jim Cathcart. Jim Cathcart 03:31 Wow. Nice job, Rich. Speaker D 03:33 Thank you. Jim Cathcart 03:34 Trigger does such a good job queuing this up. And we have got a lovely lineup of personalities today and good friends. Tony Alessandra, my bud from ever forever, is out there on screen in, in La Jolla or in San Diego, California. And David Newman's joined us from Philadelphia. Right, David? Yep. Speaker D 03:59 Okay. Jim Cathcart 04:00 Got Bill Stayton up there and, and Craig Ingram and, and Lisa Marie, David and Dennis Madden and Jim Cathcart and more to come. The topic for today is Rich or famous. Which one should a person focus on? And let me do a little preview of update on what's going on with me and put this in context. Years ago, 1979, that is, years ago in Chicago at the ASTD, American Society for Training and Development, today called association for Talent Development, one of the featured speakers, besides Peter Drucker and some other big names, was Joel Weldon. Joel Weldon, one of the early, early members of the National Speakers association, as I have been, was one of my first mentors in nsa. And Joel is as powerful on a platform as anybody I've ever met in my life. And he's intentional about everything to the surgical nano bit. I mean, he. Everything that's gonna happen, he has thought through and prepared for. And he was doing a talk that day that blew everybody away. And I introduced myself, and we had some people we knew in common. And he said, you want to get some lunch? Speaker D 05:24 Let's. Jim Cathcart 05:24 Let's duck out of here. So we went to a little diner, a little cafe near the hotel. And this was down by the Blackstone Hotel in Chicago. And so we're sitting there alone, the two of us having a sandwich. And he said, so, Jim, you're starting a speaking career now. Remember, this is 1979. So that's a minute ago. And he said, so, what's your goal? Do you want to be rich or do you want to be famous? I said, I want to be famous because I think Rich will come along for the ride. And he laughed and he said, yeah, that may be the case. He said, but you might be better served focusing on becoming rich. Then you can do all the things famous people do well. And that was good advice. Now I want to show you latest update on Jim's attempt to become famous. Here's a posting I did on Facebook yesterday. We went to Barnes and Noble here in the Austin area and, and set up a table and gave a big thick chocolate chip cookie to the staff of Barnes and Noble for hosting my 25th book launch. And I had so many of the wonderful generous people endorse this book that Speaker D 06:46 I decided to take an idea from Jim Cathcart 06:48 Lisa Patrick, a co author of mine and Intelligent Curiosity book and format the people's photo with their endorsement and create what I call memes which might be used as ads or whatever. But check out who has endorsed the book and we've created memes so far. Brian Tracy, Ivan Meisner of bni, Les Brown, Nito Cobain, Tom Hopkins, Dennis Waitley, Patricia Fripp wrote the forward. Scott McCain, Ronald Reagan's eldest son, Michael Reagan, Shep Hyken, Eric Swanson, Jason Dorsey, Terry Brock, Matthew Pollard, Steve Spangler, Kate Hancock, who is one of the leading personalities in the metaverse world, talking about Web3 and, and all of that. She owns a resort in the Philippines and travels the world doing keynotes. David Averin, Howard Partridge, Tom Zigler, John Mitchell, my friend and mentor here who teaches at the University of Texas teaches success basically to the coaches and athletes at the University of Texas, Don Hudson, whom I've known since virtually since birth and Dave Reed of e speakers Tim Guard, who was in my audience the other day In Portland, Nikki McQuistion who hosts the McQuistion Perspectives Matter TV show for 33 years now on PBS out of Dallas. And I'm a co host. Al Walker and Mark Hunter, Jody Rifkin, who's a Amazon like mega ninja and here's a banner that I, I put up at the store and then got all that, got a bookmark made and we had the, the big kickoff and had a steady flow of people coming through for three solid hours and it was just a total hoot, just tons of fun. Well, let's talk about the concept of famous or rich. Which one do you focus on most? And let's, let's go around and get some folks on, on the screen here. David Newman, I invited you especially because you've helped more people get rich than most people I know. So what's what's it been for you, rich or famous? And how does that play? Speaker E 09:20 Yeah, well, I think you answered the question right there. So me personally, I would rather be rich. And I love the twist that you put on that, Jim. It's like, you know, if I'm rich, I can get to do the things that the famous people do. Being famous without being rich, it's like, Jim Cathcart 09:37 yeah, I don't know. Speaker E 09:39 So, like, you know, which one follows which? I guess it depends on your. It also, I think, depends on your ultimate destination. Jim Cathcart 09:51 So. Speaker E 09:51 And by the way, everyone has their own definition of rich, right? So for some people, it is, you know, pick a number. And some. For some people, it's 10 times that number. For some it's 100 times that number. Jim Cathcart 10:01 Well, let me define real quickly for everybody. Sure. Let's just say rich is not having to worry about money decisions anymore. Speaker E 10:09 Yes, I love that. And that's. That's pretty close to my definition as well. So when I became rich, which was maybe five, six years ago, is my definition of not having to worry about money, really, I was able to give a lot more money. So our charitable giving went from like 50 bucks here, 100 bucks there, to 500 bucks here, a thousand bucks there, 2,000 bucks there. I know folks here you might be giving five times, 10 times, 100 times that much. But when, when you have the economic resource, right. You also have the economic resource to do good in the world. Jim Cathcart 10:47 Indeed. Speaker E 10:48 And so I think the, the impact that we each make as executives, as entrepreneurs, as thought leaders, that's great. But I think in circles like ours, especially like the coaching and consulting and speaking and training world, I don't think there's enough talk about, well, okay, now you've made it. Who are you going to reach back and mentor? Who are you going to reach back and invest in or donate to or contribute to their success either through revenue? Right. So giving, donating money, like we donate money to a whole bunch of different causes, and maybe it's even mentorship. You know, some of us are paid professional mentors, but some of us also say, hey, listen, here's someone who right now doesn't have the resources necessarily to invest in themselves. But, man, I see their potential. I see their work ethic. You know, I'm gonna, you know, it's like a venture capitalist, right, that you just start putting money into things, and some don't go anywhere and some totally blow up and give you 100 times return. You know, are we investing in the future generations enough through service and mentorship and kindness and encouragement. So all of those things I think I'm able to do because I'm rich. And again, air quotes on rich. I am much more rich than famous. I will tell you that. No matter what your definition of those two words is. Jim Cathcart 12:18 Yeah, well said though. And I think about when I would put together a entity called the 101 leaders alliance just after 911 to bring together lots of organizations and individuals to teach ground level leadership and get it, get more people capable of solving problems in the walking distance geographic region around where I lived at the time on Highway 101 in California. And some of the groups couldn't afford to participate. And so what I did was I arranged with those who did participate to provide sponsored scholarships and Cathcart Institute. You know me, I, I sponsored a few of them, a handful of them myself so that we were able to go to people that we thought were worthy but not able yet and, and get them what they needed. And that's a great idea. Let me roll over to Tony Alessandra now. Dr. Anthony Alessandro sitting there in San Diego on, on that pile of riches. You've been, you've been able to endow a course at the unit at Notre Dame University where you went to school. You've, you've sponsored lots of other things. So you've certainly achieved a point in your life where you can make financial decisions without a great deal of anxiety in doing so. And at the same time you've become uniquely famous in your niche, which has been all around personality profiles and psychological assessments and that sort of thing. But you also, you know, you're in the hall of fame as a speaker and so forth. What's your take on all this? Speaker F 14:05 Well, mine's, mine's hands down riches, wealth. And that's what I've always focused on Jim Cathcart 14:13 is, Speaker F 14:15 you know, getting, getting to that point. And I, you know, part of it sometimes it goes back to your early childhood. You know, I grew up in the projects of New York City. My father was a New York City cab driver. We didn't have much money. My mother pushed all of us, the three kids, for education, but mostly me, which, you know, put that mentality in my mind to, to get educated. Yes. Undergraduate at Notre Dame, MBA at UConn, PhD at Georgia State University. But everything was focusing on how can I create wealth? And it's still, actually, I shouldn't even say it's still my focus because, you know, like David, I've gotten there and I do donate a lot of money, in fact, and please Take this with a grain of salt. I'm endowing scholarships at the University of Notre Dame. And so I have a seven figure scholarship there. And I'm also, my next goal is to do, to fund a chair. Wow, academic chair. Jim Cathcart 15:30 Yeah. Speaker F 15:31 But anyway, so yesterday I had lunch with the, the guy who handles Notre Dame giving. So he's from South Bend, but he Jim Cathcart 15:40 comes down, I'll bet he handles Notre Dame receiving more than giving. Speaker F 15:44 He does, he does. So we had lunch yesterday at a nice little place here called Mona Lisa, which is really good Sicilian food. And I said, you know, I want to, I want to contribute more. And I pulled out a check and I wrote a check for $150,000 which is part of me doing that million dollar plus endowment for the scholarship. And he said, geez, I'm going to take this back to the university, they're going to say to me, take this guy out to lunch a lot more. So, but, but, and again, let me tell you why I'm doing that. And it's just, well, I went to Notre Dame on a scholarship for need, not academics, not sports. I went for, for need. And I only got in there because I got these scholarships that really for lower income people who could not afford to go. And once I started seeing success as a speaker, that's when Notre Dame came to me and they had a very interesting little pitch, so to speak. Hey, Tony, you know, I know you've gone to the university based on me, now that you, you know, have the wherewithal financially, why don't you do that for some other kids who just like you when you were young, get accepted but can't afford to go there? Which is exactly what, what our scholarship is. And I put the scholarship in the name of my mother and father because I'm not sure I would have gotten to where I am today if it not had been primarily for my mother. And Jim, you know, my mother, God rest her soul, was just pushing, pushing for education. And so I named the scholarship in my parents name, but it's specifically for people who get accepted to the university but don't have the financial ability to attend. So anyway, that, but then again, I, Jim, I have to tell you, I, I was doing an interview with Nikki McQuistion and I think maybe she interviewed you for that NSA legacy. Yes, yeah. And she went to the fame thing and she said, you know, you done all these things, you know, you're well known. And I said, you know, Nikki, and I said, I feel a little uncomfortable when I get praise like this. It's not that I don't like it, but, you know, I never went out for this to get fame. I went out for the fortune. And, you know, I do get a little sort of uncomfortable, embarrassed. You know, I don't like people to go overboard about it. It just. It's not where I came from. I came, you know, from the projects of New York City, and that's my thing. Jim Cathcart 18:47 Yeah, that's. I know Tony. For the rest of you, I know Tony about as well as anybody can know a friend, and vice versa. And one of the things I've always admired about Tony is his daily routine focuses on exactly what he was just talking about, which was building substantial wealth and then managing it wisely. And when he gets up in the morning, instead of doing what I do, which is go for a cup of coffee and then check in on. On all my media, he goes and checks his accounts and takes care of the. The income and the outflow. And then he reaches for his coffee and, you know, it just tells you where the. Where the focus emotionally goes for him and for me. Say I'm flashier than Tony. I play guitar and sing in clubs, and I love performing. And if my voice and my audience and my fingers would hold out long enough, I would play and sing nonstop for all of eternity. I enjoy it that much when I'm speaking. I love, love, love being engaged with the audience. I don't like being in the spotlight and having them talking about me. I like them thinking with me. You know, people have said, you love the applause. No, the applause is a symptom of whether it worked or not. But sometimes you don't want applause. Sometimes you want to have an impact that causes people to go, oh, wow, that's serious. I better think about that. You know, and so applause would be a negative indicator in that kind of a setting. But what I love is engaging people and thinking together and rich, that. That's the whole point. Creating Wisdom Parlor as a parlor discussion and not as a interview show. You know, where I'm saying, and ladies and gentlemen, here's Rich Bontrager. Rich, you know, tell us how you got into this business. Speaker G 20:53 Right? Speaker B 20:54 So as I'm listening this, though, and as we're going back and forth between rich and famous, famous and rich. Part of the question is, and so far, everyone has those riches first, but what's the pathway to get there? Because a lot of people lean on. I have to get famous first to get the richest. But no one here so far has gone down that rabbit hole. So how do you get where you Jim Cathcart 21:16 want to get this little screenshot? You know, those are my social media, okay? Those are sources not of riches, but of fame for most people. Most people want to be an influencer rather than to be an incomer, you know, income producer. And. And so they strive for visibility online and they use the social media to get noticed. Speaker D 21:45 Hey, I had a chicken salad at Jim Cathcart 21:47 Fred's for lunch today. No. Okay. I went to the beach this weekend. Here's photos. Right. No, you know, I mean that. Speaker D 21:56 It. Jim Cathcart 21:56 They're trying, and it's easy, relatively easy, to get somewhat famous in the world today, but that doesn't lead to substantial underpinning. When, When Jimmy, my son, Jim Jr. Was, I don't know, 9, 10 years old, he came to me and he said, dad, I want my own money. I said, what do you mean? He said, well, like, you know, John Stan, this kid down the street, he gets an allowance and he has his own money, and I want my own money. And I said, well, I said, I'm willing to do that, but I'm not willing to do it the way they do it. You know, they just gave him so much money every week, and he would just go spend it. I said, I tell you what I'll do. I will set up a program for you so that you have and you control your own money. And I, I developed a program that ultimately went for, like, I don't know, Speaker D 22:55 five or six years. Jim Cathcart 22:57 It went for a bit until he was a senior in college. So whatever that length of time was, the first year, I told him, I will give you X dollars a month, and it has to cover all of these things. And I include. I didn't include things like insurance, you know, health insurance or, or school registration or whatever, you know, doctor visit. But I included his clothing, his toys, his tools if he was in sports, and dues that he would pay if he was joining a club or if he was going to movies or sporting events or concerts. It was those kind of things. And he and I sat down and planned out through a number of discussions how many of those in a year he would need and what it amounted to. And then we divided that by 12. And then I added some extra money in there. And I said, I'll give you 1/12 of this every month, but you have Speaker D 24:01 to keep a record of where everything Jim Cathcart 24:03 went and where everything came from. So Grandma gives you 10, 10 bucks. It goes into the plan, or if you find a dollar on the street, it goes into the plan. And so the first year was Just things that last, things that don't, you know, tangibles and intangible. Second year, it was things you, you're obligated to do and things that are discretionary and so forth. And then we ended up with a full spreadsheet that he was using each month. And this went on for that many years. And when he went off to college, he had thousands of dollars in the, in an account and he had two accounts, a savings account forever and a put and take savings account. And of course, once he got old enough to say, I want off the program, I've got it from here, he pretty much blew most of that in no time. But he learned the lessons and became skilled and at building wealth and develop the discipline of saving because I required. He saved 10% off the top of every month's allowance I gave him. Speaker B 25:13 So Jim, let me ask you a question. And for everyone else. Jim Cathcart 25:16 Yeah. Speaker B 25:17 What if you can't get your money on the riches? Speaker D 25:19 What if you struggle? Speaker B 25:20 Maybe you're not good with the money, the planning, like you're talking about. I'm curious, what does the Wisdom parlor had to say about helping people get to that point so they can have the riches to keep moving it forward? Because not everyone's money savvy. Jim Cathcart 25:33 Right. And, and everyone needs to be. People that are good with numbers are called numerate and if they're not, they're called enumerate. Like illiterate. You're not literate. There is innumeracy of a epidemic scale, pandemic scale in our country today. Kids aren't learning it and kids and schools aren't emphasizing it. I was fortunate. My grandson aced his SAT math score and now is a math teacher at Math Nasium. He's graduating college next week in Santa Barbara and he teaches at Math Nasium and he's also a full time musician, both performing and writing and producing music. Speaker D 26:21 Music. Jim Cathcart 26:22 So he's that. Thank God for that. And his sister is good with money too. But I went into a movie theater with people his age running this, the operations. And I said to the, I gave some money to the concessions girl and she said, I, you know, our computer's down, I don't know how much change to give you. I said, 39 cents. She said, well, I'm not, I'm not, I just. And let me get my supervisor. And so the manager came over as a young woman in her 20s and I spoke with her about the same thing and she said, you know, I'm not that good with math. So if you could come back in a little while, then we'll sell you this and, and we'll work out the change. I said no, let's. Never mind. Entirely unbelievable. Nobody on staff, including at the management level, could even do basic math. So we've got some serious challenges out there. But I, but let's come back to the mainstream subject. Which do you go for? I'm with Tony and David. If you get wealthy enough, you can generate the effects of fame that you would have wanted along the way. But in today's world, I say you can alternate your weight from one foot to the other without getting in real trouble and you can probably make even faster progress. So let's look at that. Is Bill Staten still with us here? Speaker H 27:56 Yeah, I'm right here. Jim Cathcart 27:58 Okay. Bill's been my financial advisor for a Speaker H 28:02 generation now, longer than we can remember. Jim Cathcart 28:04 Absolutely. And Bill's a wealth advisor and, you know, been money manager for a long time. He's an author and he created a concept called America's finest companies. And Bill, what's your thinking on rich or famous as it relates to this conversation? Speaker H 28:23 Well, let me tell you a little bit about, about my peak of fame a few years ago that I reached. Jim Cathcart 28:28 Okay. Speaker H 28:29 And it'll surprise all of you, I think. I started teaching, at our count, basic financial skills to men here at our county jail, give or take, 10 or 11 years ago. And I was going twice a month. And after one of the sessions, four of the men came up and asked for my autograph. So that was my peak of fame. Speaker F 28:51 Yeah, but they were forging your signature on a chain. Jim Cathcart 28:54 Exactly. Tony saw through that in a nanosecond. Yeah, thanks. That's it. Speaker H 29:01 But that's the only place I've ever been where four people have ever asked for my autograph. But, but I wanted to, I wanted to address one thing early. I've been in front, give or take, of about 2,500 men, seriously, at our county jail. And I have always started the question, started each session by asking the men, Raise your hand if you can honestly say when you're not in here, you don't waste at least $50 a month. I've never seen a hand go up. Never. And I have taught high schools all over Charlotte Mecklenburg, and I've asked that question down as low as ninth grade. Thousands of students, 9, 10, 11, 12, all kinds of neighborhoods. And I've only had one 14 year old girl stand up and say, Mr. State. And I've never seen $50. So everybody is wasting money and we all do it. In all kinds of ways. Think about going to a coffee place like Starbucks and paying $6 for a giant cup of coffee. And now they want a tip. Jim Cathcart 30:17 Yeah. Speaker H 30:17 You know. Jim Cathcart 30:18 Yeah. And they want to tip out a Speaker H 30:20 buck tip on top of the $6 you already gave them for 20 cents worth of coffee. I mean, it's just. It's not only absurd, it's obscene. So we waste so much money that could easily be put use. And there's so many people who have access to corporate retirement plans who don't take advantage of it when the company has given them a match because they're afraid they'll lose money in a bond plan or a stock plan. Well, if they even put it into a money market, the company's going to double 3% of their money or 4% of their money, or 5%. Where else can you go and automatically double your money overnight? So, I mean, there's simple things like that that all of us can do. I was threatened with cancer some years ago, and my mother died of cancer at age 67. So if you get a diagnosis of cancer and the doctor tells you you've got it, I don't care what the diagnosis, what they tell you, it scares the hell out of you. So it just makes you appreciate living. So being famous to me isn't worth a crap, but having enough money to be able to do what you want to do. That to me, is a rich lifestyle and has nothing to do with accumulating millions of dollars. We have clients. We have one client I can think of. She's a widow. She spends, give or take, $70,000 a year. Her portfolio right now is worth about $7 million. And she's worried that if her portfolio dropped to $4 million, would she have enough to live on? I'm wondering what her problem is. Jim Cathcart 32:09 I got to tell you a quick story. That's brilliant. Thank you, Bill. Years ago, when I lived in San Diego, there was a bellman or doorman at the Hotel del Coronado. Tony, you may remember this. This guy had been a doorman there. You know, the guy in the fancy uniform that gets the people's luggage and cars handled when they pull up. He had been there for many, many years, and I think he passed away or something. I don't remember what drew attention to him, but maybe. Maybe it was just news of a donation he had made. He donated a million dollars to the San Diego Zoo. Speaker H 32:53 Wow. Jim Cathcart 32:54 He's a dormant at a hotel. I mean, you wouldn't expect him to be making a lot of money of Course, I found out later from Jimmy, my son, who's been a hotel executive for many years, that dorman, typically on an upscale hotel, will make way over a hundred thousand a year. So this guy had been smart with his money and he became what they talked about in the book, the Millionaire next door. Speaker H 33:17 Right. Jim Cathcart 33:17 Nobody ever suspected was wealthy. Dennis Madden, you've recently retired from the Automatic Transmission Rebuilders association as executive director and now you've got your own career going and you're starting in some new directions and in the Henderson Las Vegas area. What's your take on all this? Speaker I 33:39 Well, I, I want to mention that I wrote a note, the Millionaire Next Door as something I wanted to mention because my approach is fame. I'm not interested in fame. I'm a behind the scenes person and you know that very well, Jim. I, you know, I, I'll get in front of a crowd and after about three minutes I'm enjoying it. I did a. Exactly. I did a 90 minute video training video last Friday and once I got into it and after about four takes of the first five minutes, it went pretty well. But I don't seek that type of thing, but I can enjoy it. So by default, I guess my answer to that question is rich. Jim Cathcart 34:26 Yeah, Dennis is. Dennis and I are co authors of High Rev for Small Business and it's just been a delight working with him. We've worked together for more than 10 Speaker I 34:38 years and had fun doing it. Jim Cathcart 34:40 Yep, true. Speaker I 34:41 But to that point with the Millionaire Next Door and something I wanted to, to mention is there are some incredible savings apps that I have used and this goes to something Bill had talked about with trying to have people understand about saving and these things will withdraw a couple of bucks a week or you can set it for whatever you want. It's simply roundups from your normal spending at the grocery store, so on and so forth. And, and what I found is I don't even notice that it's gone. It could be $150 in a week and I really haven't missed it. You know, I mean that seems like a lot, but it can, it can be any small amount. And for someone who is young, if they were to pursue something like that over the course of 40 years, the savings would be phenomenal. But that has been somewhat my approach to be careful with my spending. Jim Cathcart 35:49 Yep. Speaker I 35:50 It still allows me and my wife to travel and do the things that we enjoy doing, but I don't have to be famous in order to enjoy my life. And, and I, you know, seem to find a way to make money. And I'm. I'm having a great time. I think that's the most important thing. I'm having a. A blast with my retirement. Jim Cathcart 36:11 Thank you. You know, two books I just made a note of the Richest man in Babylon by George Clason. That one was sort of a prototype for Og Mandino's book the Greatest Salesman in the World, using a biblical times parable to teach the concept. And the concept in the Richest man in Babylon is the universal concept of pay yourself first. And that's. That's what Bill's saying. What. That's what Dennis is saying. If we make a priority out of setting aside money right off the top, even when we say, well, wait, wait, I could pay more of my bills with that, if we make that a habit, then money starts accumulating that we can choose to do other things with later. And that's a powerful concept. And then Kiyosaki's rich dad, poor dad. That's. That's pretty powerful stuff too. What's. What's the link you've got there, Trigger? Speaker B 37:07 I was, I was just dropping in that millionaire next door. So it's been brought up again. Highly recommend it. So I just want to drop it in. So if you're thinking about these, go get those resources. Jim Cathcart 37:17 Cool, cool. By the way, Lisa Marie, David is on the call. Lisa, if you have any comments, any input or questions, by all means. Speaker J 37:28 Yes, absolutely. I'm on the call today. I'm in listening mode because as you know, I have a big week next week and I'm doing some work here back in the background. You're going to even get a package here real soon, in the next couple of days. But when I heard the question rich or famous, my first thought was, is that all the choices, rich or famous. So I agree with Dennis. I love to help. If somebody needs help, I am definitely there and kind of in the background person. However, when I say that, I know you're probably laughing because I do enjoy standing up and giving a talk and motivating and encouraging other people. So my thought was, if I had my choice, it would be. Drumroll, please. Legacy. So for me, it's all about legacy. So I guess the money and riches would help me leave the legacy that I would like to leave in helping others, especially when it comes to children or animals. That's just kind of my thoughts today. Thank you. Jim Cathcart 38:41 I like that. And that goes back to what Tony Alessandro was talking about, to what David Newman was talking about. You know, the, the. Our ability to Leave a legacy is limited by financial resources and our physical and mental capacity. And if you become rich, well, let's take the other route for a minute. If you become famous, you can enable a whole lot of other things that you couldn't have influenced otherwise. So if you're well known, then you're probably going to have more people pick up your dinner tab than the people that really deserve to have their dinner tabs picked up. Just because people want to be seen with you, you know, have access to you, they want to pick your brain. There are lots of benefits that come with the famous side that you could leverage in reverse and use it to endorse the things that matter to you. You know, some, some famous people never seem to endorse anything that has a heart, but lots of things that have indulgence, and others seem to be constantly giving and supporting their causes. And so I think both of them give us a bigger megaphone. But you can get further with famous than you can with rich in my estimation. What do you say? Speaker B 40:13 So I, I, I'm just hearing you there, but I'm also thinking about how many of the famous. Jim Cathcart 40:19 Yeah. Speaker B 40:20 Have flamed out and crashed and have come penny. How many super bowl winners have auctioned off their super bowl rank, how many Grammy Award winners have pulled off their gold. You know, so the famous may have a shelf life. And if you're not prepared for the financial resources to handle the financial resources, you're back scrambling like everybody else. So that's another way to look at this, too. Jim Cathcart 40:43 Yeah, yeah, that, that's a good point. So I just got a note from Molly Hunt, who's the daughter of Ty Boyd. Ty Boyd was president of the National Speakers association back when I was first elected to the board of directors. And Molly's running the Thai board organization now, and they, they do speech training and presentation skills training. She was planning on being on the call today and she was telling me why she didn't make it, but I just wanted to acknowledge her. We've got assembled in this group a pretty powerful bunch of folks, and I want to give you a chance to leave a legacy like, like Lisa Marie was saying. David Newman. David, give some thought to what kind of a idea legacy you could share with us today that might extend the value of this recording that people are going to watch after this broadcast. Speaker E 41:49 Well, I don't know about legacy, but I think an important part of this legacy, because this goes back to something you mentioned at the top, Jim, about not at the top, but a few moments ago about Numeracy. Being numerate versus being innumerate. Speaker K 42:04 Yeah. Speaker E 42:04 I don't even think it's about numerical intelligence. I think it's about to leave a legacy. I think you have to be a master of sales. So, Jim, you clearly are a master of sales. Dr. Tony Alessandra, you are clearly a master of sales. Maybe most of us have mastered some sales skills. Jim Cathcart 42:28 Let me throw something in there real quick. Sure. Don Hudson is famous for saying, you know, JC to me, Jim Kafka, you know, jc, there are very few problems in the world that can't be solved with more sales. Speaker E 42:45 Yes, yes, yes, yes. So one of my early sales mentors. And this ties back to the legacy question. One of my early sales mentors, when I was. I was like, hot and heavy into learning everything I possibly could about sales and selling and tactics and strategies. He says to me, david, slow down, slow down. You seem really, really committed to be a better salesperson, and that's great. But, you know, the key to sales is be a better person. Be a better person and more sales will happen. So actually care more, give more, be more interested, be more supportive. Build relationships that are genuine relationships, not just transactional relationships to sell something because he says, people are smart. They know that there's. They know there's transactions to be made. They know what they can buy from Rich, what they can buy from Dennis, what they can buy from Bill, what they can buy from Tony and Connie and Craig and all of us. Speaker I 43:51 Yeah. Speaker E 43:52 So be a better person. And I think that might be the key to unlock our legacy is, yes, it's important. Speaker B 44:01 Whatever. Speaker E 44:01 Rich, famous, both. Whether famous leads to rich, whether rich leads to famous. But be a better person and let that be your legacy. Speaker D 44:10 Well, that's beautiful. Years ago, a sales trainer was coaching me, and I was young and naive Jim Cathcart 44:18 and I was going through all these objection. Speaker D 44:20 Handling techniques, objection overcoming techniques. And we were doing a role play. And he said, jim, stop. I said, well, why? He said, because you're about to make a sale. I said, well, that was my goal. He said, yeah, that's the problem. He said, based on what I told you about my character in this role play and what you were selling to me, you were selling me something I didn't really need and your goal was to make a sale and you were about to do so. But three days later, I would have canceled the contract because I had the legal right to do so and I would have resented you for making me buy. Jim Cathcart 45:03 He said, so your techniques were fine, but your reason was wrong. Speaker D 45:09 The goal is not to make a sale. It's to make a difference. Jim Cathcart 45:15 Whoa. Speaker H 45:17 Powerful. Jim Cathcart 45:18 Yeah. Speaker D 45:18 Connie Fife, former president of the Los Angeles National Speakers association and the head of TCAA Talent Concierge Artist Agency. And a number of other things that. Co founder of the Going Pro mentor program with me. And one of the nicest smiles on the face of the earth. What's your take on all this? Speaker G 45:44 Well, I've been listening to all this. The first thing I want to say, when you started talking about sales, we had Jim come in and do a program for our sales team at the agency. We turned around and we created a worksheet for our team. And right on the top, Jim Cathcart. And how to strengthen your sales strategy. And the one thing that we always use, you know, don't use a term. Pitching a tailored recommendation, which goes back to. Jim talked about. About creating those relationships. So everybody was given this. And I know for me, it sits right on my desk copy. Speaker D 46:25 I've got to see that. That's just. Thank you. Speaker G 46:28 I will. I will send you that copy. I was thinking that you probably know we did that, but it's. I mean, we're in sales every day. We're like, we're all in sales no matter what we do. You know, you're. You're selling, but it's not selling. It's. Again, it's building those relationships. Speaker F 46:45 Yeah. Speaker G 46:46 With people, building those networks. And we have a new gal on the team. And another reason why I had it out. I was talking to her about this today. We're not selling. I want you to build relationships. You need to go out and build relationships, Speaker D 47:03 business friendships. Because if it's not profitable, then it's. It's draining your company. Jim Cathcart 47:09 I'm gonna have to add that it's not benefiting the. Speaker D 47:12 The client, you know, so it's got to be profitable to them and that they get the talent they need that Jim Cathcart 47:18 will cause their people to say, wow, Speaker D 47:20 you've served us so well, and then got to be generating revenue, Right? Speaker E 47:26 Exactly. Speaker D 47:27 I don't want to generate money. You know, I just want to help people. Well, how many people are you going to help with $1.19. Speaker G 47:33 Right. Speaker D 47:34 How many with 119,000, you know, yeah, let's. Speaker G 47:37 Let's make a difference there. And then, going back to your question about richer, famous, we also will. Especially when we bring a new talent that we work with. I will ask that question during our discovery call. Are you looking for fame or fortune? Because I know the people that are coming in looking for the fame it is only shop life. And those that are say, I'm looking for the fortune, or a lot of them like these. And Marie say, you know what? It's neither. It's this. How can I give back? How can I create that legacy? And for me personally, I'm going to say it's a little bit of that. I'm looking for the fortune, not the fame. Although I do want the agency to be known across this, you know, industry platform. Right. But legacy, too. And I think that has changed as I've gotten older, looking at, you know, that next phase in our life. And we have grandchildren and we have another one on the way. Jim Cathcart 48:34 Good for you. Speaker G 48:35 So we're gonna have a boy this time. So we have two girls, and then we're gonna have a boy. So looking at that and saying, you know, even so the Jefferson said, I want to spend more time with them. And, you know, because we're, you know, every day is the grind, and we're hustling, and he's out as a contractor himself now, and we're doing that grind. I said, I actually said, I'm going to set a timeline. I took a book like this and I started writing it out what we wanted to look like. I said, I'm setting a timeline. I ain't never going to retire. Like, I don't ever see. I'll be like, jim, Gather. You know, we'll be still doing this, but at least if we could have that legacy and show our kids how important that is. And even on the financial side and. And the savings side and the investment side. And I know that that's come out for all five of them because they just amaze me when they come back and say, you know, they all own their own houses now and they're having kids, having babies, even next week, my daughter taking her to see Stevie Nicks in Philadelphia. David, I'll be in Philly next week. It's Stevie Nicks and somebody else. I forget now, but I was surprised. Of course, I paid for most of it already. But she said what she said this morning, because she lives in North Carolina. She was, I'm going to drive to your house, and then we'll go into Philly, and then we can take a train to Philly. She wants to go to New York City on Saturday. And I'm like, okay. She's like, but that train is going to cost $50. And, you know, and I'm like, I Jim Cathcart 50:09 think you could do that. Speaker G 50:10 She goes, but I'll have to take it out of my savings account. Kelly, I don't know if I'm ready to do that. Jim Cathcart 50:15 Very good. Speaker D 50:16 Because that's, you know, that's making prioritization decisions. Jim Cathcart 50:20 And, and that's the whole essence of it, is once you see value versus Speaker D 50:26 cost in the right light, you can make more enlightened decisions and end up in a stronger position. Thank you for that, Connie. One of the comments that Dennis made in the chat is, and then there's famous for being famous like the Kardashians, who, by the way, happened to be rich. I used to live next door to them, not literally, but one block away from them at Sherwood Country Club in California. And they had. I had a big townhome there, and they had one. They were overflowing one just a block away, and they lived next door to Tom Hopkins. But the Kardashians, that's an amazing study. You know, you look at what they did. At first, it was all about just, hey, look at me, look at me, look at me. Let's talk about me. Oh, I've talked about myself too much. What do you think about me? You know, it was all back to me on every. Every instance. But some of them really leveraged that and became billionaires with smart decision making. So even something as superficial as the Kardashians TV show, which, by the way, I did a cameo on one time, I was hosting an event, and we invited, then called Bruce Jenner to be our keynoter for the fundraising event for Jim Cathcart 51:48 the Boys and Girls Clubs. Speaker D 51:50 And when I introduced him on stage, the Kardashians film crew captured part of that and put it in their TV show, Jim's Famous. Got it. Jim Cathcart 52:02 Let me. Speaker D 52:02 Craig, you're giggling at that. Craig Ingram, hop in here and give us a pearl of wisdom or two. What's your take on all this? Speaker K 52:12 Wow. You know, there's a difference between intelligence and wisdom, right? And I always try to surround myself with people who can teach me where I can emulate how to use intelligence. Right. And that is wisdom. And so, number one, thanks for letting me be on this. This today again, you know, to be famous or wealthy, right? My goal is to have a balance of both. But I don't want to be famous to the masses. Jim Cathcart 52:41 Yeah. Speaker K 52:41 I want to be famous to the few. And what I mean by that is I strategically want the right people to know who I am. I want the gym, cat, cars. I want the JT Foxes. I want the Hugh Hilton. Right. I want, you know, Fred Fishback, who's. Who's one of my business coaches. I want Those type of people to know who I am based upon longevity of watching what I do, not just what I say. And so I do want to be famous to those type of people, like you. Right? Jim Cathcart 53:18 Yeah. Speaker K 53:18 I don't want to be famous to where the masses know who I am, because that's vanity for vanity sake. Jim Cathcart 53:27 Exactly. Speaker K 53:27 And it brings no value. And I don't think it's biblical number one and number two in. In order to gain that wealth, it's not who you know, it's who knows you. And I think that's why I. I've tried to be the person, for lack of a better term, I've tried to be the most broke person in the room, to. To be seen by the right people, to bring the right value in the right niche, make people go, wow, he can bring something to us, but yet he's coachable enough to where he has hundreds of pages of notes from the wisdom and the intelligence that we've given him. And it's just about being coachable. And I think the more coachable that I am and the more coachable people are, they gain that famous entity right to the right people. And that's, for me, that's who I want to be. Jim Cathcart 54:23 Yeah. Speaker D 54:23 That's excellent. You've raised three really powerful points. One is famous to the few. I think that's. That's a keeper for the whole meeting. To be famous to the few, meaning the few you care about whether you're famous among them. And when you isolate the group of people that if you're famous to them, everything else comes along for the ride. Good on you. That's great. Jim Cathcart 54:47 Focus. Speaker D 54:48 Another one is it's not who you know that counts. It's not who knows you that counts is not who they know that counts. What counts is this. Who's glad they know you? So look at everybody in the few that you've identified as your target field and say, how can I make each of them not all of that? Jim Cathcart 55:09 Each of them glad they know me. Speaker D 55:13 Well, the way you make people glad they know you is by finding out what they want and practicing Zigler's famous line, you can get everything in life you want if you just help enough other people get what they want. But it requires first you figure out what they want and then find a way to help them get it. And I think that's absolutely beautiful. Jim Cathcart 55:36 And then there's one. Speaker D 55:37 The other thing you said, Craig, was wisdom versus intelligence, or as opposed to intelligence. If you look at intelligence, it's the ability to make distinctions Like a surgeon, when they look at a human body, they can distinguish all the many millions of little parts that. And systems that make that body what it is, and they know which ones are vital and which ones are not and so forth. A person without that kind of intelligence, they look at a human body and they say, oh, there's Bill. You know, I mean, that's as far as they go with that, that thinking. Now, I taught intelligence as part of the ACORN principle training and went into pretty much depth and breadth on that subject. So I could run with that for a while. But I want to take intelligence and just think that's knowing more about something and understanding the systems in it and knowing how to make decisions about it. Jim Cathcart 56:41 Let's set that aside for a second Speaker D 56:43 and let's look at wisdom and where wisdom evolves from. If, if the base is complete ignorance, you know, you know nothing. You're just ignorant of the fact that anything exists. Next stage is to see raw data, Jim Cathcart 57:01 random facts, you know, like a bunch Speaker D 57:04 of, like, if I took a whole bunch of different tools, small tools, out of a toolkit and threw them on the floor, all you would see is a bunch of pieces on the floor. Unless you realize there were tools. If you organize those tools according to type, then the organization of the data into groupings creates information. So now you're actually, you're not just aware, but you're informed. Now, information, if you look at those types of tools, you'd say, okay, these tools could be used for this. Those tools could be used for that. Now then the information, by being applied and studied individually, reveals knowledge. So you go from ignorance to information by organizing the data. You study the data and group it, and that reveals knowledge. You start applying the knowledge and it yields understanding. You look for the principles and the prep, the processes or the systems that operate within the understanding, and it reveals wisdom. So wisdom evolves through a process of the sorting, studying and applying of information over that continuum. And that's what the wisdom parlor is about. It's not a debate, you know, intentionally not a debate. It's not a bunch of isolated interviews. It's a parlor discussion like we've been having right here to maybe to help popularize that concept more in the world and get more people saying, hey, come over to the house Wednesday night. We're going to have a parlor discussion. And people just start talking about, instead of debating, interesting ideas, because this is a gathering of interesting people talking about important ideas in a forum that honors everybody's contribution. And we're at quitting time for this one. But I want you to know that what we've done today I think is very important and I value your participation in this. Thank you, Jim. Speaker B 59:21 Before we wrap up, I just want to ask you, what's your biggest takeaway? We've had great discussion, great insights. I'm just curious, as you distill this last hour down, what's your biggest aha out of this discussion? Speaker D 59:32 My personal biggest aha is probably what Craig said, you know, the famous to the few that, that really makes the point so well, because famous like, like suntan oil, you know, just put all over everything is this thick and not worth anything. But famous to the few, man, that's where you put the antibiotic, where the cut is and the wound goes away. Speaker B 60:00 Fantastic. Thank you everyone for your input, for your discussions, your insights. And again, as we wind down here today, this edition of the Wisdom Parlor. Thanks for joining us today for this edition and Jim Cathcart will be back again. Join us next month as we continue monthly even throughout the summertime. We'll be back again July 5th, mark your calendars. Also August 2nd, we'll be back once again when the Wisdom Wednesday, First Wednesday of the month, Wisdom Wednesdays, and again the doors will open up again. Come back ready to discuss, explore and dive into another topic with greater wisdom, greater understanding with the award winning world class speaker, bestselling author and mentor Jim Cathcart himself and the rest of us that fill up the Parlor. Thanks for being here today. Till next time, thank you, Rich. Speaker D 60:45 And look in the chat. I've got a link there to the Going Pro Experts Academy. So if you're interested in that, by all means click through and let's chat. Thank you, David Newman. Once again, I appreciate the training that led me to create the Experts Academy. Jim Cathcart 61:02 Thanks everyone. Speaker D 61:03 See ya. Speaker A 61:07 Thank you for joining us today in the Wisdom Parlor, a thoughtful discussion of important ideas among people who are committed to succeeding in life. If you are committed to making more success happen in your own life, go right now to my website, free.cathcart.com and download my free ebook and then watch the video. If you decide that you'd like my assistance in helping grow your success, then come with me and let's discover how much more successful you can be. Thank you for joining us today in the Wisdom Podcast Parlor, a thoughtful discussion of important ideas among people who are committed to succeeding in life. If you are committed to making more success happen in your own life, go right now to my website free.carcart.com and download my free ebook and then watch the video. Speaker D 62:23 If you. Speaker A 62:24 If you decide that you'd like my assistance in helping grow your success, then come with me, and let's discover how much more successful you can be.